0:00 0 seconds Well, get ready for this. And you know, when I say that, I don't disappoint. 0:05 5 seconds Jordan Flower is the executive director of the Disclosure Foundation. And I think I know he's humble, so he may not like me saying this, but for my money, 0:12 12 seconds one of the smartest guys, one of the smartest voices covering this topic right now, Jordan, thanks so much for coming on here to UAP again. Really happy to have you back. 0:20 20 seconds Thanks so much for having me, man. And uh thanks a lot for setting the bar high there. I look forward to uh I look forward to falling under the bar. Uh, 0:29 29 seconds that's right. That's right. It's all downhill from here. That's right. That's right. 0:33 33 seconds No, but there there is a lot uh that you've been covering. There's a lot that you've been doing interviews on and there's um I want to talk to you about 0:41 41 seconds all those different things. Uh starting with I mean, we're just going to go right for the fast pitch here. Uh what's been really hot and heavy the past week, 0:50 50 seconds I would say, is the news. Um the comment maybe is is the better term from Representative Eric Burlson, someone I 0:58 58 seconds know who you and I both know. Um and he put out very specifically which I thought was a big moment for him to come 1:07 1 minute, 7 seconds out specifically mentioning the luring operation of UFOs that has taken place. 1:13 1 minute, 13 seconds I confirmed it here with uh one of my sources, Anthony Williams, who was on the show just before you previously on a two-part episode that we did. and I 1:21 1 minute, 21 seconds asked him to confirm that those things have happened and he all but said yes without saying yes because of his previous work. Um and so those things 1:30 1 minute, 30 seconds have been happening and they have happened and Eric Burlson made a point to say that these luring operations have 1:37 1 minute, 37 seconds been successful and things have been brought down. So with that comment out there now Jordan um what was your 1:45 1 minute, 45 seconds takeaway from that and where do you think this goes from here? What kind of attention do you want to see that draw? 1:51 1 minute, 51 seconds Who says what? Like what what happens next? 1:54 1 minute, 54 seconds Um I was similarly delighted that Representative Berles uh said what he said. I think it takes some bravery uh 2:03 2 minutes, 3 seconds and courage to do that. Um I think there are forces that do not want him to say things like that. Uh and so I was 2:12 2 minutes, 12 seconds certainly delighted that that that was the case. In many ways, it was confirmation of things that he had 2:19 2 minutes, 19 seconds already alluded to uh in other interviews, but to just have the uh to use his voice to provide clarity uh not 2:28 2 minutes, 28 seconds only that this happened, but also uh who exactly was there. I I think that's 2:35 2 minutes, 35 seconds incredibly important. Um and so I was certainly um excited to see that that was there. 2:44 2 minutes, 44 seconds Um, and I'm, it sounds like your audience is familiar with this event. Uh 2:50 2 minutes, 50 seconds and so what we can we're in this bizarre place now where we have sitting members 2:58 2 minutes, 58 seconds of Congress who have been briefed on this incursion who have confirmed that it happened that it's true uh that it 3:08 3 minutes, 8 seconds was a luring operation that the ODNI, the FBI, the CIA, 3:15 3 minutes, 15 seconds right? um potentially uh arrow and you know if I'm betting uh that they were 3:24 3 minutes, 24 seconds and they were using nuclear assets to bring these things in the DOE as well and uh Representative Burlesen also 3:32 3 minutes, 32 seconds mentioned uh military intelligence in his uh in his tweet about this and I would again 3:41 3 minutes, 41 seconds bet dimes to dollars that uh AFOSI I a fosi or the air force office of special investigation, 3:48 3 minutes, 48 seconds right, would be one of those um entities uh aware of participating in uh present for 3:58 3 minutes, 58 seconds uh this this operation. So, we're in this really bizarre place now, uh, that's starting to feel a bit like 4:06 4 minutes, 6 seconds Kabuki Theater of PE members of the Gang of Eight, senior leaders in Congress having been briefed on this operation. 4:14 4 minutes, 14 seconds And yet, we continue to receive the um, uh, we need more data. uh the there's no 4:24 4 minutes, 24 seconds proof of extraterrestrial uh sort of line from uh arrow from that office and 4:33 4 minutes, 33 seconds you know I've said previously I think the ground is receding quite uh in an accelerating pace um and and and sort of 4:42 4 minutes, 42 seconds painting themselves into a into a corner. So, apologies for the mixed metaphors there, but no, it's true. 4:48 4 minutes, 48 seconds We're forced to be in this Kabuki theater of like, uh, this happened. It's confirmed. Uh, they're luring these things. At minimum, they're luring these 4:56 4 minutes, 56 seconds things, if not bringing them down and then retrieving them. Uh and then that of course implies that not only that the 5:05 5 minutes, 5 seconds government knows that these that there's a reality to this whatever it is uh but that they have the means to bring them 5:14 5 minutes, 14 seconds down and that means is proven to be successful. I mean the the logical conclusions from all of this continue to 5:21 5 minutes, 21 seconds cascade into uh something that continues to be shocking that uh the mainstream 5:28 5 minutes, 28 seconds media won't cover. Perhaps one of the reasons they won't cover it is the same reason that's been frustrating other journalists in this space, which is that 5:36 5 minutes, 36 seconds every attempt to get comment from uh the DO um and from the agencies themselves has 5:45 5 minutes, 45 seconds been met with deafening silence. Uh I the people that I've spoken with haven't even uh gotten a you know confirmation 5:54 5 minutes, 54 seconds receipt email much less a um uh a robust response to to the to the questions 6:01 6 minutes, 1 second asked. Yeah, it's and it is frustrating in that aspect because here we have um I I think personally it was one of the 6:09 6 minutes, 9 seconds bigger moments I can remember in recent memory and if there's been a lot of things happened that's you know that have happened in the past few years 6:17 6 minutes, 17 seconds given anything of testimonies at the hearings or the press conference that that we were at back in June. I mean, there's been a lot of things that have happened within the past few years, but 6:25 6 minutes, 25 seconds to have a sitting member of Congress come out and specifically say FBI, CIA, ODNI, um you mentioned some of the other 6:34 6 minutes, 34 seconds possibilities, but at least those were on site when a successful luring operation of UFOs took place. It's like, hello, what are we doing here? Why is 6:43 6 minutes, 43 seconds this not all Why is this not on the front of the New York Times, the Washington Post, and CNN and Fox News and everybody? Like this is that's a big 6:51 6 minutes, 51 seconds thing, right? Am I am I taking crazy pills here, Jordan, or is that not a big deal? Right? What what's going on? 7:00 7 minutes Uh I send people that meme of uh Mugatu. 7:04 7 minutes, 4 seconds They're like, I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. I send that to my team all the time. They will 100% vouch for that. 7:12 7 minutes, 12 seconds Um that that that really that really hits home uh for me. Uh, I do not think you're taking crazy pills. I think this 7:20 7 minutes, 20 seconds is part of the sort of uh hall of mirrors and the muddying of waters that you become accustomed to uh in this in 7:29 7 minutes, 29 seconds this space and not knowing what's right in front of you, not knowing uh how solid the you know trying to find 7:36 7 minutes, 36 seconds terrairma um to to to take next steps forward. Uh, so I think they, you know, 7:43 7 minutes, 43 seconds suffice it to say, I think they're in a pickle about this and, uh, I will continue my efforts to try and raise awareness for the mainstream about this. 7:53 7 minutes, 53 seconds I I know that a few people are working on it. Um, I would love to, you know, Dr. Phil has sort of uh, entered the 8:00 8 minutes chat in a meaningful way, right? I've been quite impressed with the conversations and attention to detail he's had on this subject and leveraging his platform to do so. 8:11 8 minutes, 11 seconds Um I may reach out to Dr. Phil and see if he's willing to to discuss this topic um 8:18 8 minutes, 18 seconds with with me or others in a public way to shine a light on it because I do think it's it's critically important and 8:25 8 minutes, 25 seconds it will continue to apply um pressure to the people that don't want to have pressure applied to them. 8:33 8 minutes, 33 seconds And that's the thing, right? And um I I'm glad you brought up Dr. Phil because I do want to bring up that interview he did with David Grush. It was probably, for my money, the most uh comprehensive 8:42 8 minutes, 42 seconds and revealing interview I've seen with with Grush so far. Um, and that includes his his congressional testimony. So, was that was fantastic. So, we will get to 8:49 8 minutes, 49 seconds that hopefully if we have time. But for your to your point, right, for the people who don't want to have their feet held to the fire, for the people who 8:57 8 minutes, 57 seconds don't want to be held accountable on this, um Ross Colart, I thought, brought up a good point and he actually is something that I saw that he tagged you 9:03 9 minutes, 3 seconds in on Twitter on this story where it's and you kind of you brought it up as well, just the hypocrisy or even the 9:11 9 minutes, 11 seconds contradiction. It's like a living breathing contradiction that's taking place where you have city members of Congress saying that these things are 9:19 9 minutes, 19 seconds happening that the intelligence uh officials and the intelligence departments were there present to see it happen but then at the same time you 9:26 9 minutes, 26 seconds have these same apparatuses who are denying or at least not even saying anything and responding about it. So something's not adding up here Jordan. I 9:35 9 minutes, 35 seconds mean what So I I guess the question is what happens from here? What is it going to take if this isn't getting their 9:44 9 minutes, 44 seconds attention? What is it going to take for these apparatuses to finally come out and at least at least comment on this type of thing? 9:54 9 minutes, 54 seconds Well, in in some sad way, I think what it's going to take is for them to uh create some dissembling response with uh 10:03 10 minutes, 3 seconds word games uh to uh to try and half address the issue without uh exposing 10:11 10 minutes, 11 seconds themselves to further inquiry. For example, uh the I mentioned before this sort of comment arrow has having a 10:19 10 minutes, 19 seconds tendency to hide behind the word extraterrestrial but then to um you know not be willing to also back up similar 10:28 10 minutes, 28 seconds statements if you just swap that word out for uh something else like non-human intelligence um object or what is it uh 10:38 10 minutes, 38 seconds technologies of unknown origin or I would or something else like uh just technological capabilities that are 10:46 10 minutes, 46 seconds beyond next generation that we have no other explanation for in uh you know advanced engineering, right? 10:54 10 minutes, 54 seconds Um and there's a reason why they hide behind that. It's because it's very difficult to, you know, these word games 11:03 11 minutes, 3 seconds are real. Um and uh it's it's easy to say, "Oh, there's no proof it's extraterrestrial." 11:11 11 minutes, 11 seconds How would you even prove that something is extraterrestrial that you see in the 11:18 11 minutes, 18 seconds sky? Um, you would you would really I think in order to prove it's extraterrestrial, you would really need 11:25 11 minutes, 25 seconds to like get a sample from it, look at uh, you know, do like a spectral analysis and see if it's like you know 11:32 11 minutes, 32 seconds has the same amount of neutrons in it like isotope that you would expect to see in this solar system or planet, you know. 11:40 11 minutes, 40 seconds uh but simply just observing something. 11:44 11 minutes, 44 seconds How would you even prove that something like that is is extraterrestrial as opposed to like having a hypothesis that this is um uh a technology of unknown 11:53 11 minutes, 53 seconds origin or a uh you know some form of intelligence that we don't readily understand. But again, it it doesn't 12:00 12 minutes even need to be non-human intelligence or technology of unknown origin for this to be a uh five alarm fire from a 12:09 12 minutes, 9 seconds national security perspective. I mean, um let's just stipulate for a second that the uh operation was real and let's 12:17 12 minutes, 17 seconds stipulate that they uh brought things down and then look at the scenario analysis where it's uh not non-human 12:26 12 minutes, 26 seconds intelligence, but it's um incredibly advanced like uh Chinese uh ISR platforms like surveillance and 12:35 12 minutes, 35 seconds reconnaissance that we can't explain how they work uh are infiltr infiltrating our nuclear equities. Uh that's not a good answer either, you know, right? 12:44 12 minutes, 44 seconds Um that's a five alarm fire. Um so there's really no good answer here for um 12:52 12 minutes, 52 seconds uh for what's happening. And I I've I've made this comment before that 12:59 12 minutes, 59 seconds this is causing such a I you know people talk about catastrophic disclosure. How about like a just a catastrophic fraying 13:08 13 minutes, 8 seconds of like the social psyche uh that we need to have be um for a democratic 13:16 13 minutes, 16 seconds republic where we need to like be able to have an understanding of what the truth is and a shared truth in order to 13:24 13 minutes, 24 seconds uh operate as a society. uh just being lied to all the time. Um is incredibly 13:32 13 minutes, 32 seconds damaging and phrased that social trust trust in institutions um it feels like it's really reaching 13:40 13 minutes, 40 seconds some sort of breaking point or boiling point and I've said before that um I think you could run as like a single platform candidate in this country on 13:48 13 minutes, 48 seconds transparency and to be clear not UAP transparency just transparency generally um I was sort of 13:57 13 minutes, 57 seconds uh misqued in that Times article a little bit. Um but uh yeah, you could run as a single issue candidate and I 14:04 14 minutes, 4 seconds think you would get elected if you just promised people that you would be transparent with them and tell them the truth. Uh that's a strong platform right 14:13 14 minutes, 13 seconds now. There's political capital in that and the the work at the Disclosure Foundation has also proved out that that political capital is there. You will 14:21 14 minutes, 21 seconds continue to get reelected if you push for uh transparency. Yeah, you're right. 14:26 14 minutes, 26 seconds It's it's a it's a passionate issue for people is to be just tell me the truth for God's sakes. Um on on that note, 14:34 14 minutes, 34 seconds there's two more things I want to bring up on this before we we move on. Uh the reports that say I don't know what to make of this, so I want to bring it up 14:42 14 minutes, 42 seconds to you. reports that say that uh the president is or has had conversations about these operations with Pete Hexath 14:51 14 minutes, 51 seconds uh secretary of war to basically greenlight these operations to bring down craft so we can reverse engineer them. What are you hearing about that? 14:59 14 minutes, 59 seconds Is that just you know internet fodder or is there something behind that do you think? 15:06 15 minutes, 6 seconds Um I've had no conversations to indicate um uh that that is true or you know said 15:14 15 minutes, 14 seconds differently um you know I have no information there. I don't know is the answer. Um I I've I spoke with Ross 15:22 15 minutes, 22 seconds about this. Uh I watched his special. I thought it was excellent. Um and he uh 15:29 15 minutes, 29 seconds he just has different sources uh I think than uh than I do. And I think he mentioned in I'm confident actually he mentioned 15:38 15 minutes, 38 seconds in his thing that he's spoken with like administration officials there um that uh are are telling him that. So I I 15:47 15 minutes, 47 seconds don't know uh Trump's awareness awareness um I think there's a question 15:53 15 minutes, 53 seconds regardless of if Trump um sort of ordered this is orchestrating it etc. Uh 16:02 16 minutes, 2 seconds the question still remains is the full truth or results and data etc making its 16:09 16 minutes, 9 seconds way back up the chain uh to President Trump. Um, and that would be, you know, 16:19 16 minutes, 19 seconds I I I would care more about that or I think that's equally important perhaps uh as understanding if he directed it is if 16:28 16 minutes, 28 seconds that information is like flowing freely uh up and down the chain regardless of if he if he ordered it because of how it 16:36 16 minutes, 36 seconds relates to these um you know the the stated interest in transparency and the push for such through the uh pursue program. 16:45 16 minutes, 45 seconds Yeah. And it's it's an interesting point. It's a very interesting thought and um you know that report by Ross was kind of a bombshell. So I guess we'll 16:53 16 minutes, 53 seconds just you know see how that continues to to develop I suppose. Um last thing on on this one here Jordan was actually a 16:59 16 minutes, 59 seconds comment that I received on Twitter uh on on this subject uh from M Huntington7. 17:08 17 minutes, 8 seconds And it's kind of a devil's advocate play here. And normally, you know, if someone comes at me negatively, you know, they're being a jerk or whatever, I 17:15 17 minutes, 15 seconds normally ignore it and at least I try to, you know, have no one's ever negative on social media, so you know, of course. But this comment I thought 17:24 17 minutes, 24 seconds was it was fair. It was negative to the story, but it was a fair question. So, I want to bring this up to you as a devil's advocate point. um when 17:33 17 minutes, 33 seconds we're talking about, you know, the the lowering and down downing of craft. His comment was location, date and time, 17:40 17 minutes, 40 seconds names of people involved, what actually occurred, what was seen, what technique was used, where where is the official report, where is there reviewable 17:48 17 minutes, 48 seconds evidence? And his point was this is a non-transparent report and essentially, you know, tabloid fodder uh in in other 17:58 17 minutes, 58 seconds words. And my comment back to him was it's complicated. Okay. It's complicated, but also it's a fair point 18:05 18 minutes, 5 seconds to bring up. So, I present that to you and and let you respond to something like that. 18:11 18 minutes, 11 seconds Sure. So, the the basic who, what, when, where, why, right? Um, and any any 18:22 18 minutes, 22 seconds questions about that are are are fair questions. I uh so um 18:31 18 minutes, 31 seconds probably the most important thing to reference here is that the reason that I started talking about this is precisely because there is a fact pattern 18:39 18 minutes, 39 seconds associated with this right when the pursuit okay the okay let let me take a let me take a step back so 18:46 18 minutes, 46 seconds there are several documents in the pursue releases that appear to evidence 18:54 18 minutes, 54 seconds this operation. Um, and I I have a very high degree of confidence that the 19:01 19 minutes, 1 second information from these pursue releases is the same uh uh activity or set of activities uh that was happening uh as 19:10 19 minutes, 10 seconds part of this UAP luring operation. So this would be the FBI 302 interview of senior uh intelligence officials from 19:19 19 minutes, 19 seconds the office of the director of national intelligence. There is a personal statement uh from these senior intelligence officers as well. They 19:28 19 minutes, 28 seconds describe flying around in a helicopter chasing red orbs. Um this isn't me 19:37 19 minutes, 37 seconds saying this. This isn't um you know some random person out there making wild 19:44 19 minutes, 44 seconds claims. These are FBI 302 documents 19:51 19 minutes, 51 seconds describing how ODI officials were on the ground in a helicopter 19:58 19 minutes, 58 seconds chasing red orbs around. Right? So that's evidence for the who. uh evidence 20:06 20 minutes, 6 seconds for the when p the pursue documents tell you when it says late 2025 right in the right in the filings right 20:14 20 minutes, 14 seconds now I've had conversations where um it sounds like there's significant activity 20:21 20 minutes, 21 seconds for this in like December 2025 but like you don't even need that like there's evidence from the you know the president 20:30 20 minutes, 30 seconds of the United States uh you know initiative on this that says late 2025. 20:36 20 minutes, 36 seconds Um the where uh it also says uh western United States. Um I think in one of my prior interviews I had said like 20:44 20 minutes, 44 seconds southwestern cuz I'm from Texas and think of everything as you know the southwest and and I think that was 20:51 20 minutes, 51 seconds like um motivated by my personal confidence that this happened at White Sands as well. But I believe the actual 21:00 21 minutes language about the location in the pursue releases says quote western United States and the information uh the 21:08 21 minutes, 8 seconds evidence associated with that says um sensitive military facility. Right. So 21:15 21 minutes, 15 seconds that's a win. That's good enough for me and it's definitely good enough for a foyer request. 21:21 21 minutes, 21 seconds Uh that's the uh the wear. Um and we can 21:26 21 minutes, 26 seconds foyer that too. Um it's the who uh which is the FB at minimum the FBI and the OD and II. 21:36 21 minutes, 36 seconds Uh so I I've you know it's difficult to for me to understand if such comments 21:43 21 minutes, 43 seconds are made uh based on ignorance or bad faith but um or perhaps both. Uh but uh 21:52 21 minutes, 52 seconds that's why I wanted to like I'm running around banging the pot on this is because there is significant evidence 21:59 21 minutes, 59 seconds that this uh occurred or this series of activities occurred. I think that's one 22:05 22 minutes, 5 seconds of the reasons why and even to in one of the interviews that Representative Berles did where he described it as 22:13 22 minutes, 13 seconds incontrovertible proof uh and quote very successful that there was a real phenomena here's something uh happening. 22:22 22 minutes, 22 seconds So, um, you know, the fallback argument there for the debunkers is is what? 22:29 22 minutes, 29 seconds That, uh, you know, Berles is lying about, uh, this or getting a, 22:36 22 minutes, 36 seconds uh, um, getting a briefing. I mean, lying, you know, from the ODNI or that the ODNI, like what do you have to 22:45 22 minutes, 45 seconds believe to to to think that this is not true? You have to believe that he's lying or that people lied to him. um 22:52 22 minutes, 52 seconds pretty sure that uh you know so I think the um sort of the the the difficult 23:01 23 minutes, 1 second it's extremely difficult to explain this away from a uh debunkers perspective and 23:09 23 minutes, 9 seconds I think more will continue to come out uh from this. Yeah, I think that's 23:16 23 minutes, 16 seconds really really uh well said. And I'll even add to it by kind of piggybacking off what you said there, Jordan, which 23:22 23 minutes, 22 seconds is this isn't a, you know, uh guy who just started a podcast in his garage and 23:30 23 minutes, 30 seconds just trying to make a viral post and just saying, "Hey, this happened. I swear I know it happened. This is that I can understand if you raise an eyebrow 23:38 23 minutes, 38 seconds and be like, "Okay, well, who are you and how do you know that?" This is a sitting congressman, like we said from the start, who is putting out this information confidently. And by the way, 23:47 23 minutes, 47 seconds if we just mix in the muddy waters of politics, a congressman who is up for reelection in the primaries in in the or he won his primary, but in the midterm 23:55 23 minutes, 55 seconds elections in November. So if he's coming out looking like a crazy person and ruffling feathers of the FBI and the three-letter agencies, I don't think 24:02 24 minutes, 2 seconds that's a smart play politically before your midterm election comes up in just a few months. So there's someone who has a 24:09 24 minutes, 9 seconds lot to lose by saying something that big and I think that should hold a lot of water when you know a report like that comes out. So 24:16 24 minutes, 16 seconds yeah and who has continued to say more and more about it uh as well sort of 24:22 24 minutes, 22 seconds culminating in you know his uh in his tweets uh recently the one what 24:29 24 minutes, 29 seconds was it yesterday or two days ago. Um, right. 24:32 24 minutes, 32 seconds Yeah. So, I think that there's um and just uh I think it's also important for you know 24:41 24 minutes, 41 seconds this person in the audience generally to understand that you know Steve Scaliz a member of the gang of eight right uh 24:49 24 minutes, 49 seconds confirmed that he received this briefing and we know that several other members of Congress uh have received this 24:57 24 minutes, 57 seconds briefing as well. this briefing happened. There are right presumably materials you could foyer 25:04 25 minutes, 4 seconds from this briefing. Are they going to tell you exactly like what was discussed there? No. But the point is that like 25:12 25 minutes, 12 seconds you should be able to establish whether or not uh this um this briefing happened. 25:21 25 minutes, 21 seconds That's right. And that's that's a great point. And I think just to um you know kind of put a a a bow on this entire 25:28 25 minutes, 28 seconds thing for this topic anyway to think about how well wait a minute so if this happened and that means what was just 25:36 25 minutes, 36 seconds you know this was a one-off it was like an experiment and hey guys it worked good job I think it's pretty safe to presume I won't even say assume it's 25:44 25 minutes, 44 seconds safe to conclude based off of something like this and based off of other testimonies out there um that this was 25:52 25 minutes, 52 seconds one of many times s that this was attempted, done, and done successfully. 25:58 25 minutes, 58 seconds So, they do it once. It's not like, you know, they're not going to it's not like they're going to stop doing it. It's been done before. It's going to going to be done again, I would presume. Um it's 26:08 26 minutes, 8 seconds it's just it's an incredible thing to take into consideration. So, indeed, I mean, I think if you Ross's 26:15 26 minutes, 15 seconds comments indicated that this could be ongoing, right? Um what I find uh you 26:24 26 minutes, 24 seconds know spooky and a little scary is um the airspace restrictions and sort of 26:33 26 minutes, 33 seconds catastrophic events that happened in this area um shortly thereafter. So you know let's 26:42 26 minutes, 42 seconds run that uh scenario. Let's stipulate that um that this is true in the sense that there's some sort of oper there's 26:50 26 minutes, 50 seconds weird stuff flying around. We had a bunch of agencies try to go bring it down um or see what it is, bring it 26:57 26 minutes, 57 seconds down, etc. Um and that this happened in late 2025, let's just say December 2025. 27:04 27 minutes, 4 seconds Now, if if that's happening, let's just stipulate that that's true for a second. 27:09 27 minutes, 9 seconds If that's happening, I highly doubt that uh on whatever January 1st, if this has been successful on January 1st, they're 27:17 27 minutes, 17 seconds just going to say, "Great, let's pick up our toys and take them back to Virginia or, you know, uh uh Los Alamos or 27:25 27 minutes, 25 seconds wherever." My guess is they're probably going to leave some of the toys there and some of the capabilities um to to deal with 27:32 27 minutes, 32 seconds this. So then in February we have a um 27:38 27 minutes, 38 seconds you know we have reports of the uh airspace over New Mexico being shuttered right 27:45 27 minutes, 45 seconds um with almost no uh advanced notice right from the FFA uh sorry from the FAA 27:52 27 minutes, 52 seconds um to local municipalities etc shutting it down for I believe it was initially said to be 10 days. 27:58 27 minutes, 58 seconds Yeah. Um uh and that there were reports of a 28:05 28 minutes, 5 seconds high-powered laser uh being deployed uh by at Fort Bliss but you know by members of the military and intelligence 28:14 28 minutes, 14 seconds community. Um, okay. 28:18 28 minutes, 18 seconds That and they that was explained away I think initially as 28:25 28 minutes, 25 seconds being for cartel drones and then separately um as like a party balloon, you know. I 28:33 28 minutes, 33 seconds I I So government's using our high-powered laser systems to to shoot down uh party balloons, right? 28:42 28 minutes, 42 seconds Sure. Um, so that happened in in in uh February 28:50 28 minutes, 50 seconds and there's some bizarre attempts to scramble and explain away what happened there. And then sadly, you have this 29:00 29 minutes crash from May that's now been getting more attention, which I also, you know, want to make sure that your audience 29:07 29 minutes, 7 seconds understands what's happening here. Um, this is a flight a a civilian flight that had departed from Roswell, New Mexico of all places. 29:16 29 minutes, 16 seconds Um, and was uh brought down and crashed because of the deployment of what was 29:25 29 minutes, 25 seconds described in the article I read as a quote experimental GPS jammer. Um, now 29:35 29 minutes, 35 seconds to me that sounds like a fun way to describe some sort of uh directed energy 29:42 29 minutes, 42 seconds weapon. Um, I'm no I'm no physicist. Uh, but um, deploying a experimental GPS 29:51 29 minutes, 51 seconds jammer and killing American civilians in the process. Uh, that's horrific. 29:59 29 minutes, 59 seconds That's a terrible story. that is something that itself should be uh should be foyed and people should be up in arms about um 30:07 30 minutes, 7 seconds absolutely and that I'm confident that they you know do not want to talk about further. 30:12 30 minutes, 12 seconds So, I guess my point there is there's these it's not just this sort of uh 30:20 30 minutes, 20 seconds alleged UAP luring operation uh as stated. It's also these other events 30:27 30 minutes, 27 seconds that have happened and have had confirmation in, you know, nonUAP world media that these are real events and 30:34 30 minutes, 34 seconds they really happened. Uh from the, you know, the high-powered laser thing to the uh civilian air crash. So there 30:43 30 minutes, 43 seconds there are some very very strange things there that you know by my lights uh do 30:49 30 minutes, 49 seconds not compute as um as as stated. So right yeah it feels like you know if this was going to go to trial there 30:58 30 minutes, 58 seconds would be a mountain of evidence um for the for this case and uh it's going to continue to grow. I have a feeling. Um, 31:06 31 minutes, 6 seconds there was something, you know, again, a bunch of things on here, but I do want to get to this, too, because this was something that uh, well, I I I guess the best way to 31:15 31 minutes, 15 seconds put it, Jordan, is that a little bit of a reveal here. We're going to make some news, and I want to bring this up now because I do want to spend some time on 31:24 31 minutes, 24 seconds it before we're done today. And that is the fact um that you and I along with 31:31 31 minutes, 31 seconds with a team have been working together on a little project and this goes back to something that I mentioned here on 31:39 31 minutes, 39 seconds the show a couple of weeks ago, a week or two ago, where uh it was actually the day of the latest government trance release, which I believe was last week 31:47 31 minutes, 47 seconds as we sit here speaking right now. And I mentioned, you know what, I think it's time to put out there that I do have like a solid handful or two handfuls of 31:55 31 minutes, 55 seconds videos uh that I received from military intel sources that um show, you know, very um strange things flying in the air. 32:07 32 minutes, 7 seconds Some are full color, full full definition, showing, you know, straight up an orb flying against the clear blue sky. Others are clear footage of things 32:16 32 minutes, 16 seconds that we cannot explain. And those videos were presented to me in uh you know illegal non-classified way. They're not 32:23 32 minutes, 23 seconds classified videos. So nobody was breaking any rules or anything. They're just videos that people haven't seen before. And so I made it known for the first time that I'm in possession of 32:31 32 minutes, 31 seconds those. And then the question becomes, well, why aren't you putting those out? 32:36 32 minutes, 36 seconds So there's been a lot of things that have happened in the past when it comes to trying to put those videos out. Um a lot of brick walls that I ran into 32:44 32 minutes, 44 seconds personally. um a lot of conversations behind the scenes that prevented those things from coming out. I want to make it known that I'm trying to have that happen where everybody can see these. 32:55 32 minutes, 55 seconds I'm not holding them to myself just to, you know, hold up a flag and say, "Look at me, cool guy with videos." That's not the goal here. The goal is to put these 33:02 33 minutes, 2 seconds out so people can see them. And what ended up happening as we went down the road over months was um I end up talking 33:11 33 minutes, 11 seconds to you about it. to end up talking to a couple guys on the team at the Disclosure Foundation saying, "Hey, how about we try to put this together to 33:19 33 minutes, 19 seconds have these videos come out through pursuit and send it over to um Marco Rubio, Secretary of State, um Secretary 33:29 33 minutes, 29 seconds of War Pete Hexath, and uh the Department of National Intelligence, and let's put this information out there that we're trying to get these 33:37 33 minutes, 37 seconds released." And we put this information out there even to uh congressional offices including 33:44 33 minutes, 44 seconds to kind of sign off on it so we can put this out there that uh we know these are there and we're trying to get these out 33:52 33 minutes, 52 seconds uh through you guys. So I guess I bring this to you now Jordan that uh kind of revealing that we've been working on this together. Did I miss anything and 34:00 34 minutes what else do you think is important to say on this uh so people know what's going on? 34:05 34 minutes, 5 seconds Um well I think the first thing I would say is thank you for being a good partner in these efforts. Um, I mean, 34:14 34 minutes, 14 seconds having discretion, uh, not being sensationalistic, uh, trying to be, uh, extremely careful 34:22 34 minutes, 22 seconds with how these things are handled, uh, how they're presented and how they're ultimately, um, framed for communication 34:31 34 minutes, 31 seconds with, um, you know, members in Congress, and then ultimately for the the people in the pursuit program. So, um, I'm I'm 34:40 34 minutes, 40 seconds very grateful for that. I think that um you know is evidence of evidence of being like a a good trusted partner uh 34:49 34 minutes, 49 seconds who level-headed um that builds a lot of trust with like your current sources and I think it demonstrates a significant 34:57 34 minutes, 57 seconds amount of uh potential trust for future sources you might have that they want to come for you and or come through you I 35:03 35 minutes, 3 seconds should say and then um and then frankly demonstrates a degree of efficacy in in 35:11 35 minutes, 11 seconds what you're doing. Um, and so to the extent that like uh you've been a delight to work with there. Um, and it's 35:19 35 minutes, 19 seconds an honor to help you. And however we can be helpful as an organization, we certainly want to be as we sort of 35:26 35 minutes, 26 seconds bridge things like this that come across with uh members of Congress to try to make sure that they uh get to the right 35:34 35 minutes, 34 seconds place and ultimately get out there one way or another. Right. 35:38 35 minutes, 38 seconds Yeah. Um so I appreciate that. 35:41 35 minutes, 41 seconds Yeah, just a lot of like gratitude there. That's how we like to operate. Um 35:47 35 minutes, 47 seconds you know in terms of um I in term you know I I think that's mostly 35:53 35 minutes, 53 seconds what I I have to say about it. I I think um you know that's that's in process. Um it's it's not a guarantee of 36:02 36 minutes, 2 seconds of anything. Um I always in our organization and even in conversations with you, you know, try to make sure 36:09 36 minutes, 9 seconds that you, you know, sort of set um uh you know, low expectations so you can try and work to to exceed them, right? 36:22 36 minutes, 22 seconds Um and uh you know, so if there's anything else you want to tee up for the audience in terms of of content there, 36:29 36 minutes, 29 seconds um I leave that to you. But yeah, just to communicate that, you know, we're really trying our darnest to get 36:37 36 minutes, 37 seconds anything that we're aware of uh that exists uh to get that out there in a um in in a careful way. 36:46 36 minutes, 46 seconds Yeah. And and and I appreciate that. I know all the kind words there. It's and it's my pleasure to work with you guys on it. Um and so I think it's just it's 36:54 36 minutes, 54 seconds just kind of that, right? It's I wanted to let people know where it stands, why these things haven't come out. Um, I think I saw someone comment on one of my 37:02 37 minutes, 2 seconds YouTube things stating that I might be a useful idiot and I may be an idiot and hopefully I'm useful, but in this in 37:10 37 minutes, 10 seconds this situation um I don't I personally don't think that's true because there's just a lot that has gone on over 37:18 37 minutes, 18 seconds uh this year quite frankly of trying to figure out how to do this the best way possible uh to get these out to people 37:26 37 minutes, 26 seconds for them to see it. and it within the five government trance drops thus far, maybe a sixth one comes out by the time this episode comes out with you and I. 37:34 37 minutes, 34 seconds Um, but none of those videos that we're talking about uh that are in my possession have come out within these government trenches. And so it it's 37:43 37 minutes, 43 seconds something that we're working on. Again, it's just kind of like, hey, pulling the curtain back a little bit to let you know this isn't an abstract thing. This is something that's being taken 37:50 37 minutes, 50 seconds seriously at the highest levels and um we're trying to figure out the right way to do it. So yeah, and we don't like to talk about a lot of 37:57 37 minutes, 57 seconds that stuff until we it it actually it actually happens. Um um and you know, your audience might 38:05 38 minutes, 5 seconds appreciate so appreciate knowing I guess you just said one of the core things which is you know it's our understanding that none of these videos have 38:14 38 minutes, 14 seconds previously seen the light of day or been included anywhere. And then um I guess 38:21 38 minutes, 21 seconds the second thing would be um which is a question I have for you. I I'm pretty 38:28 38 minutes, 28 seconds sure that these are not the same uh Dylan Borland had posted file names 38:35 38 minutes, 35 seconds right recently on on Twitter. I think it was Dylan um that were uh I think he or 38:43 38 minutes, 43 seconds someone had said were stored at uh Aphosi AFOSI. 38:48 38 minutes, 48 seconds Um, so your audience might be curious if those are the same videos or not. And so there's a few different, you know, potential videos coming up that people 38:55 38 minutes, 55 seconds have trained their attention on. You might want to help differentiate whether those are they or or otherwise. 39:02 39 minutes, 2 seconds Yeah. I mean, again, as far as I know, they're not the same. um because they know and the the the sad or I don't know 39:09 39 minutes, 9 seconds if sad is the right word maybe startling thing is that there are so many of these videos that uh you know over the years and that's I think thing that people 39:18 39 minutes, 18 seconds forget a lot too is you know we have recency bias with this conversation it's not just like the past 10 years these things go back decades um so it's like 39:26 39 minutes, 26 seconds where do you even begin with with some of this stuff so yeah I mean again as far as I know nothing uh not involved with some of the the files that Dylan 39:34 39 minutes, 34 seconds Borland was was talking about there. Um, uh, I mean they are involved with the 46 I believe the number was right that that 39:43 39 minutes, 43 seconds whole thing with all the 46 files the 46 files um, they were involved with that and you know we never saw anything from 39:51 39 minutes, 51 seconds those. So that's something that's again a lot of this is wait and see but wanted to put this out here today for the first time for people to know about. 40:00 40 minutes Yeah. Um, and thanks for saying that and just for folks to know that we're really trying our our darnest to uh to get 40:07 40 minutes, 7 seconds anything out there that we can that will that will help move the needle. And and this is to your point, it's not just maybe that's a point that's perhaps not 40:16 40 minutes, 16 seconds clear to people like this is a pathway to get things out through the Pursue platform, right? Through the Pursue initiative. 40:26 40 minutes, 26 seconds like it's not all stuff sitting in uh government servers that uh uh that 40:34 40 minutes, 34 seconds they're searching for and getting out on like the government side. Um there are things that um and some things 40:42 40 minutes, 42 seconds that we worked on that helped get pushed through on the uh on the pursuit releases. Right. 40:48 40 minutes, 48 seconds Right. Um I think that's helpful for folks to know that that that pathway exists um which might not have been 40:57 40 minutes, 57 seconds clear before you know people just sitting around waiting to be uh fed information. I mean if you have things 41:05 41 minutes, 5 seconds uh that uh are impactful uh whatever those assets may be if it's u you know 41:11 41 minutes, 11 seconds documents, videos, photos, etc. that this is a real opportunity to to get those things out and have them be 41:18 41 minutes, 18 seconds validated and and get a a national audience for those. 41:22 41 minutes, 22 seconds Yeah. No, 100%. Um, so to be continued on on that front. We'll give you more updates when we when we have them on on 41:29 41 minutes, 29 seconds that. Um, but I did want to bring up the Dr. Phil interview as well, Jordan, with with David Gush. We mentioned it earlier, and I just I I just wanted to 41:36 41 minutes, 36 seconds get your take on it overall. I know this, you know, it's kind of been uh beat with a stick at this point by all the analysts and everybody who covers 41:44 41 minutes, 44 seconds this subject, but we haven't spoken about together, so I want to talk about it with you. And that is, you know, a lot of the things that he said, um, I mentioned earlier, I thought it was the 41:52 41 minutes, 52 seconds most revealing interview I've seen with David Grush talking about, you know, possibly, you know, 20 to 25 different 41:59 41 minutes, 59 seconds craft recovered, uh, the biologics that have been recovered. the communication. 42:04 42 minutes, 4 seconds Um, I've never heard him say that before. The communication, direct communication with, you know, extraterrestrial beings. Dr. Phil seems shocked by a lot of things that that he 42:12 42 minutes, 12 seconds was saying. There's a lot of big implications in that interview. So, got to study some of those answers. What were your takeaways from that? And how 42:21 42 minutes, 21 seconds do you think what he said in that that interview kind of helps? We're talking moving the ball forward. How do you think that helps to move the ball forward from here, too? 42:30 42 minutes, 30 seconds Uh generally I think these appeals directly to the president uh we live in a time when that actually works. 42:39 42 minutes, 39 seconds That's actually impactful. Um I think that hasn't really existed before. 42:44 42 minutes, 44 seconds We have seen demonstrations of presidential will in uh this topic and transparency for this topic that we 42:51 42 minutes, 51 seconds really haven't seen before, possibly ever, but certainly I don't think in you know modern modern times. Um, and so 43:00 43 minutes I've been delighted to see these uh uh personal appeals to the president, the series of videos uh uh produced by I 43:09 43 minutes, 9 seconds believe it was uh James Fox and Leslie Kaine and that includes not just Dave Crush but also um Jeff Natelli and and 43:17 43 minutes, 17 seconds Matt Brown and and Dylan Borland as well, right? 43:20 43 minutes, 20 seconds Um those are really impactful. Those have the potential to to move the needle. 43:25 43 minutes, 25 seconds direct appeals to the president have been have been working and I think they can continue to to work. Uh the 43:32 43 minutes, 32 seconds president seems to see political capital in this and to to keep going after it which I think is good for for 43:39 43 minutes, 39 seconds transparency. Uh, with respect to Dave's comments specifically, I'm delighted that he, for me, I'm just 43:48 43 minutes, 48 seconds delighted that he seems to feel empowered at this point to to say those things and to have those conversations. 43:56 43 minutes, 56 seconds Um, I mean, Dave has is extremely buttoned up on, you know, his fact set, 44:04 44 minutes, 4 seconds extremely careful uh about what he says and what he doesn't say. 44:10 44 minutes, 10 seconds And you know while there is the question of okay you've seen these things so like uh you know the public clamoring to say 44:18 44 minutes, 18 seconds well well show us you know show us what you have show us the evidence. Um you know I would feel confident that um Gush 44:27 44 minutes, 27 seconds would have no problem uh showing that evidence to the president if the president were to hear that appeal. 44:33 44 minutes, 33 seconds Right. Yes. But I think just for me it's um I am really glad to see that he feels 44:40 44 minutes, 40 seconds empowered to like you were saying to to to really push the envelope with 44:48 44 minutes, 48 seconds some of his comments and uh you know it serves another function of signaling to you know others who may be listening um 44:56 44 minutes, 56 seconds about what's out there so that you know the disclosures can either that information can come from them or it can 45:04 45 minutes, 4 seconds come from Dave if if it exists of course. Um and yeah, so I think that's a helpful like secondary uh function with 45:14 45 minutes, 14 seconds them. Um yeah. Yeah, it was it was fascinating to hear those different points and to and to your point about the videos that have 45:21 45 minutes, 21 seconds come out recently um with all the names you mentioned, you know, in connection with James Fox and Leslie Kaine. Uh it it was I felt a big moment for those 45:30 45 minutes, 30 seconds things to come out because it feels like those appeals directly to the president uh don't fall on deaf ears and you know 45:38 45 minutes, 38 seconds this administration and and the people around the president it seems like they want to be uh crowd-pleasers on this 45:46 45 minutes, 46 seconds subject. And so what I'm hoping personally is that you know it didn't fall on deaf ears. Um and they did get a 45:53 45 minutes, 53 seconds lot of traction when those videos came out. So kudos to James Fox and Leslie Kane. I believe 42 West was the uh production team that helped put that together. They were they were fantastic. 46:02 46 minutes, 2 seconds I know we got to meet them back at the June press conference. 46:04 46 minutes, 4 seconds Yeah. Yeah, it was good to meet that team. And yeah, um you know, I am grateful that, you know, James and 46:12 46 minutes, 12 seconds Leslie trusted us enough to um uh basically ask for our some of our 46:19 46 minutes, 19 seconds advice on on the messaging and uh what was happening there. Um, I'm glad we 46:25 46 minutes, 25 seconds could uh help from, you know, both a legal perspective and just to provide some initial feedback and be in a a 46:33 46 minutes, 33 seconds position of trust there because I do think that the effort is significant. We need those like those campaigns matter, 46:40 46 minutes, 40 seconds right? Um, you know, if there's but they're also expensive. Uh yeah, and um 46:48 46 minutes, 48 seconds man, if I won the lottery, I would absolutely have 42 West on retainer and would just be, you know, 46:56 46 minutes, 56 seconds uh cranking as much out uh like that as we can because I do think it it was great and it um uh it has the potential to to get noticed and and move the needle. 47:06 47 minutes, 6 seconds I I think so. And um and Eric Burlson was part of that video as well, of course, too. Um, but these direct appeals, you know, I think they play 47:14 47 minutes, 14 seconds hand in hand. Even Eric Davis recently, I believe it was a NewsNation interview off the top of my head, uh, where he said, "Look, you know, again, I know 47:22 47 minutes, 22 seconds where these things are, the craft, the bodies, I know where they are. These facilities where they're stored at, they're classified, so I can't say it." 47:30 47 minutes, 30 seconds But even he made a direct appeal through that interview, as he's had before with different interviews. If I have my NDAs, 47:37 47 minutes, 37 seconds uh, you know, revoked, I have some type of protection, then I'm happy to say everything. And I know that's what that direct appeal was as well from Jeff 47:45 47 minutes, 45 seconds Nucatelli and Matthew Brown and Dylan Borland and everybody who was who was in that that video. Let us say what we need to say. 47:53 47 minutes, 53 seconds And so if if that moment comes, Jordan, I mean, what what do you think happens from there? Um because there's been a 48:00 48 minutes lot of you know the naysayers again of course no negativity on social media ever and when you have when you have that negativity from people they come 48:09 48 minutes, 9 seconds out and they say hey look you know this new measure where the uh NDAs you know you can say what you want to say now so 48:17 48 minutes, 17 seconds come on big talkers come on and say something and that really isn't the case when it comes to that measure that came out the order that the president signed. 48:26 48 minutes, 26 seconds So can you differentiate sorry what do you mean when you say it wasn't the case? 48:30 48 minutes, 30 seconds So with that that order that came out I think it was a couple weeks ago when the president came out the news came out that he uh had signed this order saying 48:38 48 minutes, 38 seconds that people with NDAs when it came to this um uh subject could come out and and talk about it. So then there was 48:46 48 minutes, 46 seconds kind of a confusion on that of like well what can we say? Can we say everything? 48:52 48 minutes, 52 seconds But that's still not the case because now we have these videos out with, you know, the names that we mentioned. Hey, these this direct appeal, let us come 49:00 49 minutes out and say our piece. So, it's a little confusing. Um, it it is it is confusing. I I 49:08 49 minutes, 8 seconds it's tough to um now that we have so many players in the game and so many different entities, 49:17 49 minutes, 17 seconds it's becoming a bit of a crowded uh field. uh sort of crowded on the pitch and being able to differentiate you know 49:26 49 minutes, 26 seconds which entities have which uh you know what's their mandate what's their mission etc. For example you know we 49:33 49 minutes, 33 seconds okay so we've got arrow we've got pursue uh we now also have the UAP uh science advisory council that uh reportedly 49:42 49 minutes, 42 seconds works up uh reports up to the UAP governance board which is some sort of inter agency task force. Um, I think I'm 49:49 49 minutes, 49 seconds gonna ask like one of the AIs to like listen to this and create like a diagram or something. Um, yes, please send it to me when you have it. Please. Yes. 49:58 49 minutes, 58 seconds Uh, so we've got that. That's like an inter agency thing. This UAP governance board apparently unclear who sits at the top where the buck stops there. Um, and 50:07 50 minutes, 7 seconds then also reporting recently from I believe Chris Sharp and potentially others that like the UAP scientific 50:13 50 minutes, 13 seconds advisory council uh is not the only or committee is not the only committee that there are many different committees um 50:21 50 minutes, 21 seconds you know that exist underneath this uh sort of governance board. What are those committees? Who's on them? Right? Uh you 50:30 50 minutes, 30 seconds know what's the content? What's the goal? What's the mandate? uh having some clarity around that would would certainly be helpful. And then there's, 50:40 50 minutes, 40 seconds you know, we're already operating inside of the uh, you know, um, fiscal 23 NDAA 50:47 50 minutes, 47 seconds with respect to setting up uh, arrow and we're also operating under regime where there was a statute for the 50:55 50 minutes, 55 seconds um, for the um, the national archive uh, submission requirements for uh, for UAP 51:04 51 minutes, 4 seconds from agencies to, you know, put put push all of information on UAP to the to the National Archive. So, we have we have 51:11 51 minutes, 11 seconds that as part of some of these statutes. Um, and so, you know, we've got the playing field is uh is is getting cluttered. Um, 51:21 51 minutes, 21 seconds but at least there's like more activity happening. Um, I personally have found that like the DLA Piper uh client alert 51:31 51 minutes, 31 seconds that was written and sent around is perhaps the uh most clear uh and 51:39 51 minutes, 39 seconds effective piece of writing that I've seen on the current state of this uh what the structure is, what the 51:47 51 minutes, 47 seconds statutory requirements are, how the uh NDA guidance 51:54 51 minutes, 54 seconds released by Aaron Lucas at the office of uh the director for national 51:59 51 minutes, 59 seconds intelligence. How that guidance um is uh uh relates back to you know and there's 52:08 52 minutes, 8 seconds this uh that guidance was issued by result of this like uh presidential national security memo that was that was 52:16 52 minutes, 16 seconds written, right? That's that's apparently classified. Um, but the reason that that uh that the guidance was written is 52:24 52 minutes, 24 seconds because the memo's classified. So, you know, they're saying, "Okay, this memo was written, no one can see the memo, but we're going to write guidance." Um, 52:32 52 minutes, 32 seconds so we avoid this Kafka-esque scenario of like, you know, the memo talking about how NDAs uh people with NDAs can go have 52:40 52 minutes, 40 seconds conversation. People can't even read the thing that tells them that they can go uh go talk to other people. So, uh, 52:49 52 minutes, 49 seconds great. Now we have some guidance. That guidance being directed specifically towards, uh, members of the intelligence community being a little bit less clear 52:58 52 minutes, 58 seconds on, um, uh, contractors, third parties, etc. Uh, and that guidance being more 53:06 53 minutes, 6 seconds uh, being tighter, more constrained than what's already uh, part of the statute. 53:12 53 minutes, 12 seconds So, I'll say again, um, and maybe you could, uh, you know, I'd certainly appreciate if you link to that like DLA 53:19 53 minutes, 19 seconds Piper, uh, client alert, um, because it's it lays this out in like a crystal clear, you know, fashion that's I think 53:28 53 minutes, 28 seconds maybe five pages long-ish um, and and and effectively sourced back 53:35 53 minutes, 35 seconds towards the the laws that that already exist. So I think uh reading that document uh would be extremely helpful 53:43 53 minutes, 43 seconds and as I'm thinking of it now I think we need to like I need to take that document and just try and like you know 53:50 53 minutes, 50 seconds uh make it digestible in like social media some way just so like the core takeaways there can really be can really 53:58 53 minutes, 58 seconds be internalized because um you know you know fewer people watch or read like 54:07 54 minutes, 7 seconds you know right policy documents like this than you know whatever consume um videos and and all that. So make it 54:15 54 minutes, 15 seconds easier for folks to understand. Uh yeah and and and it is worth it right to have that information out there for sure because again it's it there was like this misconception I think when that 54:24 54 minutes, 24 seconds directive first came out that okay well Eric Davis you said you'll say everything well that wasn't really you know what what was being done here. It 54:32 54 minutes, 32 seconds kind of allowed for you to say different things, maybe more behind the scenes than doing a social media video and then you can, you know, say XYZ but still not 54:41 54 minutes, 41 seconds reveal it publicly. It's very it's very convoluted versus like disclosure of what to whom, right? 54:48 54 minutes, 48 seconds Like this was never contemplated to be a oh you're you know this I'm saying the presidential memo and I'm not saying 54:55 54 minutes, 55 seconds this is good or bad. I'm just saying this guidance was never contemplated to be a full release from NDAs so that you 55:02 55 minutes, 2 seconds know you could tell the public like uh everything that might include like sensitive national security information. 55:08 55 minutes, 8 seconds Exactly. Right. Yeah. It's was intended to uh clarify that um 55:16 55 minutes, 16 seconds uh to clarify that people with these NDAs could go talk to Arrow and if you don't trust Arrow then you could go talk 55:25 55 minutes, 25 seconds to uh Pursue. Um so I'm glad that they're issuing this guidance. My understanding uh is that 55:34 55 minutes, 34 seconds they will be uh clarifying the process even further potentially with another uh 55:41 55 minutes, 41 seconds memo like this to help understand um uh exactly how to like operationalize 55:48 55 minutes, 48 seconds for anyone that really wants to come forward like here are the here are the steps to do so and this is also 55:56 55 minutes, 56 seconds germanine to uh representative Burlesson's text um yesterday, August 56:02 56 minutes, 2 seconds 20th, where he says that he uh he tweeted that he is, you know, sort of 56:09 56 minutes, 9 seconds been tagged as the person who can help facilitate uh uh the anyone that comes 56:17 56 minutes, 17 seconds forward with with the with that information. Um that's right. 56:20 56 minutes, 20 seconds And yeah, you may want to like uh flash that that tweet as well. uh kind of blanking on the exact information, but that's like 56:28 56 minutes, 28 seconds no actually part of process. So it's like it's the we already there already were protections for people to come 56:36 56 minutes, 36 seconds forward with NDAs but I view this as more of a um process clarification uh at 56:46 56 minutes, 46 seconds the end of the day which I think really is uh important um for people to know uh 56:54 56 minutes, 54 seconds exactly how not only that they can come forward but like a little bit more precisely like how they should come forward. forward. 57:01 57 minutes, 1 second Yeah, I think that's the best way to put it. And um you're you're talking about the statement. 57:07 57 minutes, 7 seconds I do have that up in front of me actually. So I can read a little bit of it now just for clarification purposes. 57:12 57 minutes, 12 seconds Uh he wrote it was you know official letterhead from his office saying the office of the director of national intelligence's preliminary guidance for 57:20 57 minutes, 20 seconds waving UAP related NDAs is opening up important opportunity for individuals with relevant information to come 57:28 57 minutes, 28 seconds forward. And then he goes on to say just kind of summarizing of we've launched a new whistleblower form to make it easier to contact my office and get the 57:36 57 minutes, 36 seconds assistance assistance that you need. Um so he mentions you know the process the guidance. So I think that's kind of what people need to take away from this is 57:45 57 minutes, 45 seconds this isn't a sweeping order that says it's a free-for-all. Go baby go and say what you need to say. This is a it's 57:53 57 minutes, 53 seconds it's a process and there's guidance on it. Um right. and and that this is for you know 57:59 57 minutes, 59 seconds it's for disclosure to the executive branch right like Arrow and and Pursue 58:06 58 minutes, 6 seconds uh in particular uh which is great uh and this is different from uh making protected disclosures to Congress. So 58:15 58 minutes, 15 seconds you know our organization wrote uh you know it's policy brief number four for us. We uh spilled a lot of ink uh with a 58:22 58 minutes, 22 seconds lot of like you know actual legal references uh discussing how uh anyone can go to Congress and make a protected 58:31 58 minutes, 31 seconds disclosure uh and that there is no uh no one has ever uh you know been prosecuted much 58:40 58 minutes, 40 seconds less indicted and you know convicted uh for making a protected disclosure uh to 58:46 58 minutes, 46 seconds Congress and that would include an NDA that someone has, you could anyone with an NDA can go right now uh and make a 58:57 58 minutes, 57 seconds protected when they walk in the door in a protected environment with a member of Congress, they can say whatever they want to say and make a protected disclosure. 59:05 59 minutes, 5 seconds Now, of course, then people get up in arms about like, oh, you don't understand, you know, people put their lives at risk. Um administrative terrorism. Yes, I do understand that. 59:17 59 minutes, 17 seconds like that we are making we're trying to disagregate the problem there and say are there legal consequences criminal 59:24 59 minutes, 24 seconds civil are there potential um repercussions from administrative terrorism and are there you know 59:32 59 minutes, 32 seconds potential threats to like physical safety we're really addressing like the first two buckets and the answer is no 59:40 59 minutes, 40 seconds there is not like a no one has ever gone to prison for making those disclosures Um and based on the data, yes, you 59:49 59 minutes, 49 seconds should ac like people have uh uh you know, suffered administrative terrorism, 59:55 59 minutes, 55 seconds revocation of uh security clearances, etc. Yeah. 1:00:00 1 hour You know, I uh I almost hesitate to even bring this up because, you know, that policy brief was written a long time ago and we've had such positive updates with the kind of NDA discussion recently. 1:00:10 1 hour, 10 seconds It's, you know, again, it's it's almost more of like a marketing exercise because what's currently in statute is already uh already allows that uh to 1:00:19 1 hour, 19 seconds come forward. There are some incremental things, some interesting things like the specifically calling out NDAs that 1:00:26 1 hour, 26 seconds prevent the disclosure to the president, which uh that was an interesting uh Wow. 1:00:32 1 hour, 32 seconds Feels like that was added on purpose, you know. Yeah, that's pretty interesting. 1:00:36 1 hour, 36 seconds Um to say the least. So you know there's like um there's there's disclosure of what you 1:00:44 1 hour, 44 seconds know disclosure from whom to whom and all of those things matter whether it's 1:00:51 1 hour, 51 seconds you know disclosure from uh people in the intelligence community people from the government former government uh 1:00:58 1 hour, 58 seconds contractors etc. you know, that list of the who and then the list of the um you 1:01:06 1 hour, 1 minute, 6 seconds know, the how and then the list of the um you know, disclosure of what. Uh so 1:01:13 1 hour, 1 minute, 13 seconds that's there there the good news is that there continues to be more and more ways to actually do this and hopefully more 1:01:20 1 hour, 1 minute, 20 seconds clarity uh coming uh about that process from the u the people running the pursue initiative. 1:01:30 1 hour, 1 minute, 30 seconds Yeah. And obviously there's a lot that goes into it um which is why there's a lot of work going on behind the scenes in addition to what we're hearing you 1:01:37 1 hour, 1 minute, 37 seconds know frontf facing. Um, just a couple more things, Jordan, because I know your time is just about up, but I I am curious. You know, the word subpoena has 1:01:45 1 hour, 1 minute, 45 seconds come up a couple of times in the past when it comes to trying to get people on the stand. Um, even Eric Burlson mentioned uh in one of his recent tweets 1:01:54 1 hour, 1 minute, 54 seconds that they might have another hearing soon based off of some of these things that are going on that we're talking about here today. Do you think it would 1:02:01 1 hour, 2 minutes, 1 second be um would it behoove because again, talk about a lot that goes into something, a lot goes into this. Would 1:02:08 1 hour, 2 minutes, 8 seconds it behoove Congress to subpoena government contractors, meaning heads of industry, Lockheed, Boeing, Rathon, 1:02:17 1 hour, 2 minutes, 17 seconds MITER, um you know, these these private companies that you know 1:02:23 1 hour, 2 minutes, 23 seconds allegedly uh work behind the scenes to as people have said, you know, reverse engineer some of this technology that 1:02:31 1 hour, 2 minutes, 31 seconds has been brought down. Um, is that something is that is that a path you think they would even try to go down and do you think they should go down? 1:02:41 1 hour, 2 minutes, 41 seconds Um, you know, it's certainly it's certainly a tool um at their disposal, 1:02:48 1 hour, 2 minutes, 48 seconds but you know, there's, you know, let's let's back up a little bit. So, there's 1:02:55 1 hour, 2 minutes, 55 seconds the um the the discussion of hearings, right? Um 1:03:03 1 hour, 3 minutes, 3 seconds and most of the hearings so far have been you know people coming willfully right so could you um have people come 1:03:11 1 hour, 3 minutes, 11 seconds in willfully to discuss uh certain of these things um personally I really hope that we can have a public hearing that's 1:03:20 1 hour, 3 minutes, 20 seconds really science-based um so getting our you know the best PhDs uh and maybe the scientific advisory committee uh is 1:03:28 1 hour, 3 minutes, 28 seconds going to sort of serve this function I would really like there to be a purely science focused hearing uh on the 1:03:36 1 hour, 3 minutes, 36 seconds science of UAP um from some of our best thinkers uh on the subject and hopefully you know people um you know certainly 1:03:45 1 hour, 3 minutes, 45 seconds people that have expertise in this but hopefully also people from outside of uh you know who are more like independent 1:03:53 1 hour, 3 minutes, 53 seconds voices. Um I would love to see that. So, you know, at a PhD level, uh, talking about about 1:04:02 1 hour, 4 minutes, 2 seconds this and the reality and what and what they're seeing there, I think that would drive home a lot of the like, uh, this 1:04:09 1 hour, 4 minutes, 9 seconds sort of like intellectual and academic seriousness um, that underlies the topic 1:04:15 1 hour, 4 minutes, 15 seconds and uh, be a bad day for some of the uh, you know, incredulous and bad faith 1:04:22 1 hour, 4 minutes, 22 seconds debunkers out there. Um, so I'd like to see that. Um, I would I I I almost feel like it's it's like I would like to see 1:04:31 1 hour, 4 minutes, 31 seconds this and I also feel like it's um almost a moral imperative. 1:04:36 1 hour, 4 minutes, 36 seconds John Kosowski needs to sit down and be questioned in public about whether he knew about this UAP luring operation. 1:04:48 1 hour, 4 minutes, 48 seconds like I I feel really really strongly about that and we'll certainly be 1:04:55 1 hour, 4 minutes, 55 seconds advocating for uh that or something similar to that uh happening on on 1:05:02 1 hour, 5 minutes, 2 seconds Capitol Hill. Uh maybe that conversation happens in private first and then in public. I I I don't know. But why there 1:05:09 1 hour, 5 minutes, 9 seconds has to be accountability for uh uh some of these claims that are that are being 1:05:16 1 hour, 5 minutes, 16 seconds made and the kabuki theater of this happening versus like the sort of message of incredul uh coming from the 1:05:26 1 hour, 5 minutes, 26 seconds office that's purportedly responsible for uh getting to the bottom of the UAP topic. 1:05:32 1 hour, 5 minutes, 32 seconds Right. Um, moving to the discussion of subpoenas. Um, you know, one of our 1:05:40 1 hour, 5 minutes, 40 seconds primary jobs at the Disclosure Foundation is really trying to um push for uh Congress and others in 1:05:47 1 hour, 5 minutes, 47 seconds government to use all the tools at their disposal. So, you know, we have the um we have the Committee on the Declassification of Federal Secrets. 1:05:57 1 hour, 5 minutes, 57 seconds That's uh where a lot of the folks pushing for transparency on the UAP subject have come from. Uh so one of the tools could be a special committee. Um 1:06:06 1 hour, 6 minutes, 6 seconds uh you know kind of the church pike committee style investigations. 1:06:11 1 hour, 6 minutes, 11 seconds Um um I think that would be uh a great step. 1:06:18 1 hour, 6 minutes, 18 seconds Uh a special committee would have subpoena power. One of the current issues uh with respect to slinging out 1:06:24 1 hour, 6 minutes, 24 seconds subpoenas is my understanding is that they're uh 1:06:33 1 hour, 6 minutes, 33 seconds this uh committee or the task force on the declassification of federal secrets like doesn't have its own subpoena 1:06:41 1 hour, 6 minutes, 41 seconds power. So they have to appeal to leadership like Comr in order to uh get 1:06:47 1 hour, 6 minutes, 47 seconds subpoenas sent right. Um, now they may have that and I think uh, Representative 1:06:54 1 hour, 6 minutes, 54 seconds Luna has described in some way how she's um, there's some backing there from 1:07:01 1 hour, 7 minutes, 1 second leadership to pursue subpoenas, but subpoenas are a um, they're not a panacea either. So, there's a few 1:07:09 1 hour, 7 minutes, 9 seconds structural things that are difficult with subpoenas. Um, and 1:07:15 1 hour, 7 minutes, 15 seconds one of those things is, um, that the people you're subpoening can ride these 1:07:22 1 hour, 7 minutes, 22 seconds things out. I mean, look at the look at what happened with, um, I mean, there's all kinds of examples, but in the same way that there's like games you can 1:07:30 1 hour, 7 minutes, 30 seconds play, you know, in the court system and with the law, there are games that you can play with subpoenas. And one of 1:07:37 1 hour, 7 minutes, 37 seconds those games is, you know, salmon's in sports. it's run out the clock. So, if there's a changeover uh from, you know, 1:07:46 1 hour, 7 minutes, 46 seconds Republicans to Democrats in the House, then that may uh somebody that receives 1:07:54 1 hour, 7 minutes, 54 seconds a subpoena today knows that they can just wait that out until, you know, leadership changes over and then, uh, 1:08:04 1 hour, 8 minutes, 4 seconds you know, the prior one wouldn't be enforced. they would have to wait for a new one and they might have an estimation that um it's less likely that 1:08:12 1 hour, 8 minutes, 12 seconds they would receive like a follow-on subpoena from Democrats. So, there are games you can play and time is of the essence. If that's going to happen, it 1:08:21 1 hour, 8 minutes, 21 seconds needs to happen now. Um there's also um this also ties into questions of immunity, amnesty, etc. 1:08:34 1 hour, 8 minutes, 34 seconds um you know you can if people were to come in under subpoena everyone sort of saw this famously recently with uh 1:08:42 1 hour, 8 minutes, 42 seconds Fouchy right so right uh took a while for him to get in when they finally did hold him make contempt bring him in that 1:08:49 1 hour, 8 minutes, 49 seconds what did he do he pled the fifth right so nobody learned anything um and you know smartly people pointed out 1:08:57 1 hour, 8 minutes, 57 seconds with the Fouchy thing that like if you've already been given like immunity for uh crimes or potential crimes that 1:09:07 1 hour, 9 minutes, 7 seconds you you can't plead the fifth. You can only plead the fifth for something that like it's it's selfinccrimination like 1:09:14 1 hour, 9 minutes, 14 seconds you can't plead the fifth for something that you can't be incriminated for, right? 1:09:20 1 hour, 9 minutes, 20 seconds So, and the smart lawyers uh on the government side, specifically Holly 1:09:27 1 hour, 9 minutes, 27 seconds actually act who's you know uh forget about politics. I mean, the guy's like a Yale law grad. He's a smart guy. He He's 1:09:36 1 hour, 9 minutes, 36 seconds hyper aware of like the context in which uh subpoenas and pleading the fifth like matter and when 1:09:43 1 hour, 9 minutes, 43 seconds it when it doesn't. Um so, you know, then that gets tied in with the questions of like immunity. So, if you 1:09:51 1 hour, 9 minutes, 51 seconds want to have someone actually come in and have a productive conversation like under subpoena, um, uh, that could be 1:09:58 1 hour, 9 minutes, 58 seconds hindered by them pleading the fifth and then in order to obviate their the legal option of pleading the fifth, you would need to then like potentially grant like 1:10:06 1 hour, 10 minutes, 6 seconds immunity. And then you get into the question of immunity uh, you know, to whom and for what. Um, yeah. 1:10:15 1 hour, 10 minutes, 15 seconds Uh, you know, there's some allegedly some pretty horrific things that have been done like for these programs. you uh probably maybe don't want to provide 1:10:24 1 hour, 10 minutes, 24 seconds immunity for that. You provide immunity for for specific things and that's more more time, more work, right? So, 1:10:32 1 hour, 10 minutes, 32 seconds you know, it's um you know, anyone who's saying, "Oh, we should do subpoenas." It's it I'm not disagreeing that you 1:10:40 1 hour, 10 minutes, 40 seconds know in some circumstances yeah I would really like to see that but it's a um it's a fasile answer and it requires uh 1:10:49 1 hour, 10 minutes, 49 seconds strategy planning and really setting a foundation if you want to have uh subpoenas be um 1:10:57 1 hour, 10 minutes, 57 seconds effectuated and have impact in the way that like those of us pushing for transparency in the UAP topic want them to have impact. Uh, so apologies for the 1:11:06 1 hour, 11 minutes, 6 seconds um, you know, sort of the that might have been a little bit too deep on like the legal front. No. 1:11:13 1 hour, 11 minutes, 13 seconds Um, but I hope it conveys like a sense that like subpoenas are not a panacea. 1:11:19 1 hour, 11 minutes, 19 seconds It's a it's a process, you know, it's like, you know, it's do you have the power to do so? Uh, who's who is doing 1:11:28 1 hour, 11 minutes, 28 seconds it? And then it's a process to uh effectuate that and then once it is effectuated can you actually get the 1:11:36 1 hour, 11 minutes, 36 seconds information that you that you want. Um and so that's something that we try and advise about with respect to um you know 1:11:44 1 hour, 11 minutes, 44 seconds the UAP topic in Congress as well. And you know it suffices to say uh sooner rather than later yes do it sooner 1:11:52 1 hour, 11 minutes, 52 seconds rather than later like the clock is ticking. Let's go. Right. No, I put it really well on that, which is why I 1:12:00 1 hour, 12 minutes asked you the question because I knew that you would be able to really break it down um like like many other people can't. So, I think uh it's it's an 1:12:08 1 hour, 12 minutes, 8 seconds important conversation to have, an important answer to hear broken down a toz like that. So, no, absolutely appreciate you uh taking the time to do 1:12:16 1 hour, 12 minutes, 16 seconds that for us. Um, I I I'll get you out of here on this one, Jordan, because I have to ask, of course, about the one thing that everybody keeps bringing up when 1:12:25 1 hour, 12 minutes, 25 seconds you talk about hypotheticals and you talk about more complicated than it seems. What are you hearing, if anything, on a possible presidential 1:12:33 1 hour, 12 minutes, 33 seconds speech? Um, this keeps coming up. You know, it's going to happen. It might happen. Well, maybe it's not going to 1:12:40 1 hour, 12 minutes, 40 seconds happen. And it just keeps going. We're on this carousel it seems like or even a a continuous roller coaster of up and down on whether or not there's going to 1:12:48 1 hour, 12 minutes, 48 seconds be a presidential disclosure speech. Are you hearing anything different than anybody else's on this? Like is there a real possibility that it could happen or that it's even being spoken about? 1:12:59 1 hour, 12 minutes, 59 seconds Um the short answer is I I really have nothing for you on like I don't know 1:13:08 1 hour, 13 minutes, 8 seconds about the presidential speech. Um, I do think that the um sort of the elevated, 1:13:14 1 hour, 13 minutes, 14 seconds you know, volume and frequency of uh people talking about that in those reports, I think it's interesting. 1:13:20 1 hour, 13 minutes, 20 seconds Um, I uh I believe Chris Sharp has reported a lot of that stuff. I uh I like Chris. I think he has good sources. 1:13:29 1 hour, 13 minutes, 29 seconds Um, and does his speech exist? You know, I I don't I don't know. Um, there was some 1:13:38 1 hour, 13 minutes, 38 seconds What was it? It was the I think it was there was a podcast recently with Robert Bigalow or Robert Brickolo like put 1:13:45 1 hour, 13 minutes, 45 seconds forward his comments to President Trump about you know how he should do it and 1:13:52 1 hour, 13 minutes, 52 seconds um simply having it be short, sweet, concise on the walk to whatever it is Air Force One or Marine One and having 1:14:00 1 hour, 14 minutes it effectively be a um a confirmation speech and then let the you know sort of 1:14:08 1 hour, 14 minutes, 8 seconds the the cascade of questions and follow on come from there. Um, you know, 1:14:17 1 hour, 14 minutes, 17 seconds you know, do I think that is the optimal speech? I don't know. But do I think that that would uh be a push for more 1:14:26 1 hour, 14 minutes, 26 seconds transparency if it were if it happened that way? Yeah. Like I'd rather have that than not have it, you know? 1:14:33 1 hour, 14 minutes, 33 seconds Right. Right. Um and then of course you there's constant uh moving the goalposts 1:14:40 1 hour, 14 minutes, 40 seconds like in this business and that was the you know the end goal for uh most people 1:14:47 1 hour, 14 minutes, 47 seconds for most of the time and uh I'm confident if and when that moment comes uh guess what it won't be good enough. 1:14:55 1 hour, 14 minutes, 55 seconds Um so but do I think that it will be that that something like that could be effective? Yes. I I just I have no 1:15:03 1 hour, 15 minutes, 3 seconds insight on if it exists, if it's happening. Um, you know, the data uh certainly aren't good 1:15:12 1 hour, 15 minutes, 12 seconds for people that uh have claimed that there's going to be uh a speech. Um and 1:15:21 1 hour, 15 minutes, 21 seconds uh yeah, so I think making such uh you know, proclamations uh is not a uh uh 1:15:31 1 hour, 15 minutes, 31 seconds there's no winning track record there and so I'm certainly hesitant to speculate in addition to not knowing. 1:15:38 1 hour, 15 minutes, 38 seconds Yeah. No, perfectly fair. I'm glad that we can get it out there. Um Jordan, thanks so much for doing this, man. It's always a pleasure. It's always an honor 1:15:46 1 hour, 15 minutes, 46 seconds to have you on and just really kind of, you know, chop it up on this subject to try to put out as much as we can and as 1:15:53 1 hour, 15 minutes, 53 seconds much information as we can on this. I know that's exactly what you guys are trying to do at the Disclosure Foundation. Um, is there's are there things that are coming up for you guys 1:16:02 1 hour, 16 minutes, 2 seconds that you're working on behind the scenes that people should be aware of on the Disclosure Foundation front? 1:16:08 1 hour, 16 minutes, 8 seconds Yeah, thanks for asking. Um, I'm really excited about uh this NASA archival review. Uh, okay. So, this is sort of 1:16:17 1 hour, 16 minutes, 17 seconds taking the um the legislation that's in effect about how 1:16:24 1 hour, 16 minutes, 24 seconds agencies need to submit their information to the National Archives as it relates to UAP. 1:16:32 1 hour, 16 minutes, 32 seconds um you know we're basically saying hey we can make NASA's job easier and doing that like with volunteers from 1:16:40 1 hour, 16 minutes, 40 seconds our organization. So you know that uh working team is headed by Mike Gold 1:16:48 1 hour, 16 minutes, 48 seconds former NASA administrator uh on that working team are also um uh Beatatric 1:16:54 1 hour, 16 minutes, 54 seconds Vel uh Dr. Reggie Brothers, uh, Manelli Durk Shani, uh, Travis Taylor, uh, 1:17:02 1 hour, 17 minutes, 2 seconds Steven Brule, and I'm on there as kind of the connective tissue with like the workstream and and the leadership of the 1:17:09 1 hour, 17 minutes, 9 seconds Disclosure Foundation. So, I'm really excited about that. Like, great team, uh, fun, you know, fun vibe, 1:17:17 1 hour, 17 minutes, 17 seconds good people, and I think the potential to do really great work. Um, and then I'm also excited about, and this is a 1:17:26 1 hour, 17 minutes, 26 seconds little bit like uh like news for us is um 1:17:33 1 hour, 17 minutes, 33 seconds there's a really interesting read of this um uh sort of national archives like record 1:17:41 1 hour, 17 minutes, 41 seconds production statute. And when you you know typically when um when there's 1:17:48 1 hour, 17 minutes, 48 seconds records requests they are they're agency records. So that means like agency you know government agencies are required to produce information. 1:18:00 1 hour, 18 minutes But when you actually read the statute, um it says in the statute not uh uh 1:18:10 1 hour, 18 minutes, 10 seconds agency records uh it says records from governmentf funded uh projects like and operations. 1:18:22 1 hour, 18 minutes, 22 seconds So, we've, you know, we have a pretty incredible like legal team um as part of 1:18:30 1 hour, 18 minutes, 30 seconds our organization and some sharp minds pointed this out recently and 1:18:37 1 hour, 18 minutes, 37 seconds uh so what does that mean? Well, it means that it's not only that if read in 1:18:45 1 hour, 18 minutes, 45 seconds plain language, um, it means that not only should, you know, agencies like, you know, NASA or, you 1:18:54 1 hour, 18 minutes, 54 seconds know, the CIA or the DIA or whatever it is provide their UAP records to the National Archive uh, as part of this 1:19:02 1 hour, 19 minutes, 2 seconds legislation, but also any government funded initiatives. You know, you know where government funding is right in the 1:19:10 1 hour, 19 minutes, 10 seconds name? Federally funded research and development centers. That's the one. 1:19:15 1 hour, 19 minutes, 15 seconds Uh and so there's been a lot of great work done recently on uh some how these 1:19:22 1 hour, 19 minutes, 22 seconds FFRDC's are involved in this. I think you know UAP Gerbin had one on MITER recently um 1:19:30 1 hour, 19 minutes, 30 seconds and and there's been others as well uh in Lincoln Labs right there was a letter sent by um represent Bur Berles to 1:19:39 1 hour, 19 minutes, 39 seconds Lincoln Labs for production you know preservation and production of information from Lincoln Labs um you 1:19:46 1 hour, 19 minutes, 46 seconds know these organizations are significant players uh we believe in this uh you 1:19:55 1 hour, 19 minutes, 55 seconds constellation of government activity on UAP and I don't think any of them are um 1:20:03 1 hour, 20 minutes, 3 seconds realizing and certainly no one is currently enforcing that we think this legislation actually includes them under 1:20:11 1 hour, 20 minutes, 11 seconds the purview of uh records production to NAR of UAP information that's something I want to you know sort of talking about 1:20:20 1 hour, 20 minutes, 20 seconds that for the first time here I want to shine a bright light on at um and we're 1:20:26 1 hour, 20 minutes, 26 seconds going to try and work on a policy paper uh soon to shore up this argument from a you know 1:20:35 1 hour, 20 minutes, 35 seconds from a a legal perspective. You know, make sure we have our eyes dotted and our tees crossed on this legal read and 1:20:43 1 hour, 20 minutes, 43 seconds then socialize that with partners in Congress and then see what other potential legal and enforcement actions may be available for production of this 1:20:51 1 hour, 20 minutes, 51 seconds information. Um and you know and it might not just be FFRDC's. I think you know as read in plain language 1:21:00 1 hour, 21 minutes government funded um you know it's going to be a tough one to argue that FFRDC's aren't aren't involved there but there's 1:21:08 1 hour, 21 minutes, 8 seconds an even further argument that uh some of the programs uh themselves at the 1:21:15 1 hour, 21 minutes, 15 seconds defense primes could be uh could fall under this. So, um, that requires a little bit more. Again, that's a little 1:21:24 1 hour, 21 minutes, 24 seconds bit more speculative, but I mean, uh, that's something that we intend to, uh, 1:21:31 1 hour, 21 minutes, 31 seconds put pen to paper to, uh, over the near term and would we'll be excited to, uh, to sort of share our our read on that. 1:21:41 1 hour, 21 minutes, 41 seconds And then there's the so what of what do we okay you know if if everyone agrees that they are included how do you take 1:21:49 1 hour, 21 minutes, 49 seconds action to enforce it and to um actually get records production there. So there's 1:21:57 1 hour, 21 minutes, 57 seconds um wow hopefully some meat on the bone. Uh but sorry if I you know droned on a little bit there but I'm it's uh it it's a 1:22:05 1 hour, 22 minutes, 5 seconds little in the weeds but I'm I'm really excited about it. And for those who are deep into the uh you know the FFRDC 1:22:14 1 hour, 22 minutes, 14 seconds um you know understanding the role that they've played understand how material of of a production that could be. 1:22:22 1 hour, 22 minutes, 22 seconds No that's that's fantastic. I mean with NASA the FFRDC's you guys are you're you're digging in the right places. Um obviously as you know so that's yeah 1:22:31 1 hour, 22 minutes, 31 seconds that's that's huge stuff and I appreciate you bringing that out here today on on UAP. Um, obviously Jordan, there's, you know, a ton more that we could talk about and cover. We'll have 1:22:40 1 hour, 22 minutes, 40 seconds to do this again another time. I appreciate you spending so much time here, uh, more than we originally planned for, and I'm really appreciate you doing that here today on on UAP. So, 1:22:48 1 hour, 22 minutes, 48 seconds hopefully we can stay in contact on some of the things we've been speaking about here today, and I'm sure we will be talking again soon. So, thank thanks a lot for doing this. 1:22:56 1 hour, 22 minutes, 56 seconds Yeah, man. Likewise. Thanks again for having me, and uh, I'm delighted that my children didn't blow up the interview because they've gotten really good at that recently. So, 1:23:04 1 hour, 23 minutes, 4 seconds I I know how that goes when I do some interviews at home. That that and the dog as well. So, yes. Yes, I know how that goes. 1:23:12 1 hour, 23 minutes, 12 seconds Hiding in the basement. Uh yeah, I know what you mean. Trying trying to find a place to hide. Just do the interview. Oh my god. I get it, man. 1:23:20 1 hour, 23 minutes, 20 seconds It's the struggles. The struggles are real. So, thanks so much, Jordan. We'll talk again soon, buddy. Thank you. All right. Have a good one, man. Bye.